It seems that a discussion of fatherhood was desperately needed. Our panel of seven fathers has shared its collective wisdom and experience in Session I and Session II to motivate others to believe that genuine, caring, committed fathers actually do exist.
Welcome to Session III of our Fatherhood Round Table Discussion. I’m excited about this session because we will get into more serious topics such as discipline, dealing with in-laws, and coping with fears.
Once again, allow me to introduce our panelists:
- Eric Payne – Father of two children and author of Makes Me Wanna Holler
- Fred Campos, Jr – Father of two children and author of The Thoughts of the Average Christian Servant
- Paul Easter, III – Father of two children and author of Dear Mr. Man
- P.J. Mullen – Father of one child and author of Real Men Drive Minivans
- L. Dijon Anderson – Father of two children and author of No Off Season for Dads
- Shawn Dennis – Father of two children and author of Dad Unmasked
- Maxwell Reddick – Father of four children and author of Soul Brother v.2
After you’re done reading this session, please visit all of the panelist’s blogs. Their writing on fatherhood is eye-opening and poignant.
Now let’s start the discussion.
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MD: How do you deal with in-laws?
Eric: As best I can. I make myself available for them when they need me. I have no issues with in-law interference. They love me as their own.
Shawn: They are great. No issues at all.
Dijon: Ours are not a problem. We get along with them very well. We have been blessed.
PJ: One of my biggest regrets is that my in-laws don’t live closer to us. They visit for a week or so at a time a few times a year, but I wish they had more opportunities to spend time with their grandson. They are great people and were a huge help when we first brought our son home from the hospital. I’m also very fortunate because my wife and mother have an excellent relationship. My mom usually visits about once a week to spend time with little man. It is a huge help because it gives us some time to relax or tackle the household minutiae that builds up.
Paul: With difficulty. My situation is strange. Too much to get into in this forum.
Max: Hmm, the old in-law question. I have been very blessed because I have some very good in-laws. However, that is not to say my relationship with my in-laws is trouble free. My in-laws are very sweet, very supportive people, but in the same instance, sometimes they can be a bit overbearing. I think we all have dealt with the phenomenon in which the children ask you for something and you say no, and then they go ask their grandparents who invariably say yes. This is what I have to deal with most often. But in each and every case, I simply return whatever it is and respectfully explain to them why we said no. Of course they protest, but I insist that they respect us as parents. And then there are those times when we seem to be competing for my wife’s attention. My wife is the youngest and the favorite, so it often seems like they need so much of her time and attention. In this instance, I leave it to my wife’s judgment. I understand that she must find a balance between being a wife and a parent and a daughter.
Fred: 1) With out-of-town in-laws, we never stay with family. We get our own car and hotel. 2) The number one priority is our own nuclear family. We visit and add our extended family secondary to our personal family needs. 3) We put huge restrictions on what our in-laws are allow to buy and do for our kids. 4) We plan out all visits accordingly and never visit or stay long enough to allow them or us to get on each other’s nerves. 5) We never feel guilty about having to be or do anything with anybody. Again we have our own family traditions and in-laws fit in where possible.
MD: What is the best fatherhood lesson that you’ve learned?
Eric: I’ve learned that it’s not about me. I can reap many personal rewards by enriching the lives of my children. By enriching them I make my own life richer.
Shawn: That kids truly have their own personalities and there is only so much I can do to influence them.
PJ: The most important thing I’ve learned since becoming a father is that I have to make sure to keep my relationship with my wife as strong as it possibly can be. Not only will this help keep us strong as a family, but will provide an example for my son that he can use in his future relationships.
Paul: I’ve learned that all my kids want is time. I give them all that I can.
Max: The greatest fatherhood lesson I have learned is to be patient and be understanding. The journey of fatherhood is a marathon and not a footrace, and sometimes the lesson must be taught and modeled over and over and over again before it gets through.
Fred: Children forgive faster than adults and can love unconditionally. Always tell your kids the truth and realize they catch more of your actions than your words.
MD: What has been your scariest moment as a parent?
Eric: Watching my daughter have an allergy induced asthma attack.
Shawn: When my 7-year old daughter was 4, she fell face first on the concrete from the top of a playhouse. Blood was everywhere.
PJ: The biggest scare I’ve had as a parent so far has been when I found blood in my son’s stool. It was after hours for our pediatricians office so my wife and I headed straight to the ER. It turned out to be only a simple milk protein allergy, but I was terrified of losing my four and a half months old son. He was the most important thing in our world. It took several hours for my heart rate to return to normal after we returned from the hospital.
Paul: My kids were involved in a car accident with my mother-in-law. I was across town and my wife was at the airport. While your wife, KayEm, picked up my wife from the airport, I sped across town to get to my children. The car was totaled and the kids were in an ambulance. Although, they seemed to be physically okay, we went to the hospital to be sure. I was tense the whole way and it wasn’t until they said three words to me that I was able to breathe. The words were, “Daddy, we’re hungry.”
Max: In 2005, my wife and I had a child that died shortly after childbirth. Early in the pregnancy my wife began to experience complications. Later we were told that if we did not choose to abort the baby, my wife would have to remain on bed rest for the remainder of the pregnancy, and even then, the baby would more than likely be born with severe birth defects. The doctor told us she would give us time to decide, but before she left the room, we both looked at each other and nodded. We chose life. And everything went perfect for a while. For a while, we thought we were out of the woods. But as predicted, the baby came early, and the baby was so underdeveloped that he could not live. As I awaited the birth, I had never been so scared in my life. I had never faced anything like this in my life. It tried both my faith and my strength. I have never prayed so hard, I have never begged God so desperately as I did in pleading for the life of my child. However, my prayers were not answered. But my child’s death was not in vain. It pulled our family closer than it has ever been.
Fred: Being a co-parent with an Ex that has significantly different parenting styles. Or stated another way, “Having the faith to give over your child without always knowing who or where they will be with for extended periods of time.” My only advice is to pray and realize statistically, the world really is a safer place for kids today than it was when we grew up. It is unfortunate the media has conditioned us to think otherwise. If you don’t believe me, read “Grown Up Digital” by Don Tapscott.
MD: What has been your most fulfilling fatherhood experience?
Eric: I could never pinpoint one. It’s a growing body work that adds to itself to on a daily basis. But if I must pick one in particular, watching my son graduate from 8th grade was pretty darn fulfilling.
Shawn: That my daughters love me unconditionally as I do them.
PJ: There hasn’t been any one thing in particular that has been especially fulfilling. I would have to say that watching my son progress and develop through the first 19 months of his life with me as his primary care provider has given me the greatest sense of fulfillment.
Paul: There really has been so many that it is hard to just name one. Children are very fulfilling.
Max: I think I am living the most fulfilling experience at this very moment. My two oldest children are away from home, and they are doing well. And my two youngest children are now teenagers, young adults, and they are rapidly becoming the young men and women we raised them to be. It is hard to believe these young men and women are the same babies we brought home from the hospital so long ago, and it is almost surreal watching them grow up so quickly.
Fred: Having a purposeful and meaningful career, two unbelievable kids, an exceptional wife and a never ending forgiving God who desires to know and hang with me every step of the way.
MD: How do you discipline your children?
Eric: I was raised in a “Spare the Rod, Spoil the Child” household. As a result I hold true to that premise as well, but not in the literal sense. I dole out punishments quite frequently (no different than I do rewards) in the form of loss of privileges (for my teenage son and loss of privileges and time outs for my daughter) because I want my kids to understand that their actions have consequences. Although I’m not averse to an occasional spanking, I do know they can create a mixed bag of results and in my own personal experience getting spanked only sparked my stubbornness as a child. In essence my soft behind kept getting softer because of my hard head. I grew up in a loud and sometimes argumentative household so I make a conscious effort not to raise my voice except when absolutely necessary as I believe if done in excess this mostly teaches your children to tune you out. I love my children and they know I do. I talk with them about everything. I answer all of their questions, even the hard and awkward ones. I play with them. I crack jokes with them. I even wrestle with them. I have thousands of pictures of them and I attend all my sons games in every sport, all year round. I am their number one fan. But I am not their friend in the sense that I am not trying to be their peer nor do I want them to be mine. We are clear on this.
Shawn: I use time outs and take away certain privileges.
PJ: Other than clearing his dinner plate from the table when he tries to feed the cat rather than himself, we really haven’t had many opportunities to discipline our son.
Paul: Without anger.
Max: Some time ago I heard or read something that had a profound effect on how I discipline my children. That something was the question, “How can you hit and inflict pain on those you profess to love even in the name of discipline.” Since then, we have not spanked our children. If they do something that needs to be addressed, we first discuss the issue with them and describe in complete detail our expectations of them. If this does not suffice, we then began to take privileges from them. Thus far this has worked. We have had no major discipline problems, only those that you could expect from children of a certain age.
Fred: Children are very different and unique. Therefore, the answer to this question is there is not a “one size fits all.” Based on the temperament, love language, and the way each child perceives pain, will determine the how each child needs to be disciplined. For my sensitive and genius five year old son, a correcting voice or the loss of a clock or calculator would pretty much end the world. For my 10 year old social daughter, not being allowed to play across the street with her friend is Hell on Earth. That said, I am not a fan of corporal punishment under any circumstances. Parents that “spank” lack creative thinking.
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That’s the end of our discussion for now. The panelists and I will continue the discussion in the comments area. Feel free to comment and ask questions in the comments section. We want your honest opinions and thoughts, but keep it civil and respectful. If you have a question or comment for a specific panelist, please address him by name and I will forward the comment to him for a response.
Tune in for the next installment of Fatherhood Roundtable where we will discuss money, religion, and other provocative topics.
Stay Strong,
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As usual there is some solid information here. It is really indicative in many ways of just how much we have in common as fathers. I appreciate this because I see us as an under served group.
I have been fortunate to be able to attend my kids activities regardless of time. So I can make it to the middle of the day events. I am not the only father who gets there, but there are few.
There is usually some sort of comment about how nice it is that I am there. Maybe I am hyper sensitive, but sometimes it feels like they are suggesting that it is unusual for a father to want to see these things and that is inaccurate.
Not that I am looking for validation, but I don’t we get enough credit for what we do.
People stop me and tell me that I’m a good father just because I take the kids to the grocery store with me. If this simple act impresses people, the bar for fatherhood is set far too low.
In response to the last question of this go-round I’d also like to add that I pray with and for my children in their presence.
okay, this one was great, too. in-laws…favorite answer…paul’s! glad for the others, but i’ve got an extremely strange situation as well. so PAUL, i feel for you!
MAX–your account of choosing life was a chilling one. my wife and i would have done the same thing. she was put on hospitalized bedrest with our triplets at 27 weeks, and we feared for their lives. for a while, it didn’t look like she’d carry them even 30 weeks, but somehow, someway, she made it to 36 weeks. today, they’re healthy, happy (LOUD) two year olds. i’m so sorry for your family that the same was not the case w/ you, but APPLAUD the courage and faith it took to go the direction you did. i am glad that you’ve found a purpose through that pain, and i salute your faith, as well as your eloquence in describing it.
the thing that fatherhood taught me was that love is selfless. and PJ, it was either you, or perhaps SEATTLE DAD i had this exchange w/ via email, but it’s incredible how much happier you are when you don’t put yourself first.
GREAT JOB GUYS!!
MOCHA DAD, thank you for emailing me! I’ll fwd this link on to my father friends. you guys are fantastic! jco
I appreciate your feedback. Hearing about your experiences raising triplets has really enriched my life.
Parents that spank lack creative thinking. That’s awfully presumptuous, not to mention completely incorrect.
My son is 20 months old and we’ve only had to resort to corporal punishment 2-3 times. And that’s only after he receives multiple warnings, explanations, a timeout and then more warnings. The spankings do not hurt him physically as we would never beat our child. But it gets the message across in that rare circumstance in which it’s called for.
What I’ll never understand, Fred, is why the “no spanking” contingent of parents feels it’s necessary to imply parents who spank are less intelligent or haven’t thought things out. I don’t knock parents who choose not to spank (even when their kids clearly deserve it), so why do non-spanking parents feel the need to judge others?
Daddy Files,
First and foremost, let me apologize if my position seems harsh, I don’t mean anything by it. Outside of this forum, I don’t make it a practice to evaluate other people’s parenting and methods of discipline without that particular parent coming to me privately and asking me for suggestions.
However, I am not green on the subject. I too grew up in a “spare the rod, spoil the child” situation and believed heavily in corporal punishment, felt it was Biblical, and at time highly justifiable. But starting out as a single parent raising a daughter in a highly contested high profile custody situation, CPS, case workers, the court, and finally my attorney suggested I find other methods of punishment. Reluctantly, I investigated other options.
Over the next three years that proceeded, I took more than 125 classroom hours at the Dallas Parenting Center, Growing Kids God’s Way (by the Ezzo’s), Systematic Training for Effective Parenting (STEP), read books on the subject and scrambled to find other ways of discipline. I have had full fledge arguments with instructors, teachers and professors on this very subject–stating “It was crazy to think you could raise kids without physical discipline.”
Today, I have the equivalent of a college degree on the subject, and found the notion to be sound, correct, and very possible if choosen. I have changed my position on the subject and have not found a case in 11 years, that could not be effectively solved another way. Karen & I have become the super nannies of our church and hometeam helping other parents find that line in discipline.
That said, everybody reading this blog are the above average parents of the world. However, working with CPS and social workers, there are too many stories of GOOD parents losing their cool and spanking and hitting getting the best of them in anger.
Having options such as… crib time, room time, re-direction, removal of the situation, transition out, transition in, time out, lights out, natural consequence, logical consequence, loss of privilege, clarification of rules, early bedtime, written apologize, loss of a meal, extra chores, family meetings, reduction of allowance, loss of item, etc. just to name a few; empowers parents with other options.
My feeling and experience in general are parents don’t want to spank, but do not always know about other options.
@ Max ~ I do not know you, nor have I read your blog, but through your answers have gained a deep respect for you and your wife as people, spouses and parents. I am sorry for the pain of your loss, but am impressed with your devotion to your children and each other.
@ MisterMan ~ Without anger. That’s a lesson I constantly have to reiterate in my life.
In-laws and scariest moments could be their own books.
Just the other day, I had to tell my daughter that I couldn’t deal with her behavior at the moment because she had made me too angry. I told her to sit in her room while I cooled off. After I was in a better state of mind, I was able to deal with the situation rationally.
Well let me add my responses.
1. The in-laws and dealing with them has been a bit of a mixed bag. As I stated in round table number 2, I’m pretty much newly married yet my wife and I have been together almost 10 years, nah, that can’t be right, damn it is. Anyway, I’ve kicked the mother out of our home during some complicated times, but as of now I won’t say everything is fine but it’s way past civil. As for my wife’s dad, all we do is disagree which I attribute not just to the fact I enjoy taking opposing views but we come from 2 completely different backgrounds. I think he tries to understand me, but he can’t. Suffice it to say since Obama became President, politics is no longer open for discussion.
2. Fatherhood has taught me so many things it’s unbelievable. I’ve had to learn patience, and that at the end of the day I am no longer first – more like 3rd right after my son and wife. While many say fatherhood is difficult, I tend to take the opposite position on this. All my son wants more than any toy is to spend time with me. Seriously, fellas. How hard is that? A simple grilled cheese sandwich together will make him feel like he can do anything. Isn’t that the attitude we want our children to grow up with?
3. Scariest moment was when my son was three going on four years old and I worked out in Brooklyn. He was home with his mother who happens to be a type one diabetic. She had taken a nap and he could not wake her up. Miraculously, he dialed his grandmother’s number and she in return called me while she had him on another phone. I could not speak to him for fear that if he hung up the phone he would not answer the phone again. I told my customers that they had 2 minutes to cash out. I was met with attitude from customers who were more concerned about buying than my son being home alone with his mother having a diabetic attack. I ended up sitting with the district manager who got the same response the customers got – my son comes first. To make a long story short, my son was a hero for saving his mom and was the talk of the hospital and police precinct where they had him until I was able to reach him. I found him there eating a McDonald’s kid’s meal. A year later, he had an emergency operation to remove his appendix. My SLMB is a trooper.
4. Most fulfilling moment for me is not a moment but two simple routines we tend to go through. One is that whenever I pick him up from school, I ask him how school was. No matter what response he may give, I never forget to ask. The second is that when he wakes up before me on school days, he will lay on my back for a few minutes knowing that I will wake up soon.
5. Discipline is a mixed bag with me. I grew up with old school parents, yet never dealt with beating but I did get one ass whopping. My moms was the law and order, while my pops with more or comic relief and I guess in that respect I take after him. I do take privileges away from my son when he does something wrong, but it’s not often.
Thanks again for your feedback. I also like to argue with my in-laws just for the fun of it.
There is way too much good stuff there to comment on everything. Thanks to all of you for your honest sharing. I will say that I believe in spanking although I have not had to do it yet. It definitely should be done as Paul says “without anger”. I also am fortunate that I haven’t had anything as scary happen with my son yet as any of you. Max I am so sorry for your past loss.
Hi there!
Great job on the panel, fellas!
I especially appreciated the perspectives about discipline. I think it is so important for parents to think about the long-term ramifications of discipline. I had a great dad (actually two great dads) but my dad who is black is “old school” so he believed in physical punishment. He also realized that after a certain age (adolescence), he was not comfortable using physical punishment with his girls. So he chose “house arrest”. He decided to ban us from existing outside of the house for a set period! Sometimes, we would have “room arrest” where we were only allowed to eat with the family and then go to our rooms. Once I was given a sentence of one year “house arrest”!! Yes! I am not kidding. A year. The thing about it is that NOW I don’t even remember what I did. I just remember being grounded for a year…
So my question for the dads is… how to you decide on the severity of the punishment that you choose for each child? Severity…meaning…the length of the punishment….and the parameters of the punishment…
Peace, blessings and DUNAMIS!
Lisa
Lisa, the punishment must fit the crime, match the pain factor of the child, the age of the child, the frequency of wrong doing, and consideration or intent of the child. For example:
A vase broken in the center living room:
Age 2: “Zachary, are you ok? Let’s stay out of this room until daddy can make it more kid friendly.” Punishment: None, parent’s fault.
Age 5: “Caitlyn, did you break the vase?” (she lies) Goes to bed 30 mins early for lying, has to help clean it up, docked $1 of allowance.
Age 5: “Zachary, did you break the vase?” (tells the truth, but hits it with a ball) Re-direction to rule six “No ball playing in the house.” Loses the ball for a week, get’s a hug for telling the truth, has to help clean it up. Has to give a verbal appology to mom (her vase).
Age 10: “Caitlyn, did you break the vase?” (she tells the truth, but this is the 2nd item she’s broke. 2nd offense.) Doesn’t get to play across the street, and has to write an appology to mom.
Age 10: “Caitlyn gets in a fight with mom and intentionally breaks the vase.” All of the above, except gets sent to bed early, grounded for a week AND has to buy mom a new vase from allowance.
etc…
Wow! A year of house arrest? You must have done something serious.
So my question for the dads is… how to you decide on the severity of the punishment that you choose for each child? Severity…meaning…the length of the punishment….and the parameters of the punishment…
My kids are young. My son will turn 9 in two weeks and my daughter is five. We work hard on providing logical consequences. It really depends on what they do and how serious it is. Not to mention we try to dole out punishment that they learn from.
Punishment has to fit the crime and temperament of the child. My son, N, who is tenderhearted constantly seeks my approval. All I have to do is raise my voice with him or express any disappointment and he immediately corrects his behavior. My daughter, on the other hand, takes much more creativity. We apply many types of punishments with her (up to an including spanking). We’re still figuring out how to effectively discipline the 2-year-old. Right now, he has to sit in the “naughty chair” for several minutes. He is a sociable child and hates to miss anything. Time in the “naughty chair” is unbearable to him.
This is absolutely wonderful! I so enjoyed reading these sessions.
I’d like to know how the dads’ relationships have changed with their wives after having children, in all aspects (ie. household chores, mom/dad roles, intimacy, etc.)
My time management skills have kicked into high gear. I have to do more housework, I love my wife more, and we have become more of a team. Every decision I make, has to be viewed through “How it will effect my family.”
Our relationship really hasn’t changed all that much. Sure, we don’t have as much time alone together as we would like, but we make the most of the time we do get to spend.
We weren’t John and Suzy homemaker before our son was born, but our home is always clean, albeit cluttered at times. As the stay at home parent I handle the errands, preparing the meals and keeping the house in some semblance of order.
When my wife is home I do give her some space with our son so the bond they have remains strong. She likes to handle diaper changes and the like when she is home, so I let her take the lead, but I don’t disappear. We handle bath time jointly and alternate bed time, especially reading him his stories.
As far as working on our relationship we take the time to go out on date nights and I do my best to prepare at least one special dinner every week. It isn’t easy, but it is working for us.
So my question for the dads is… how to you decide on the severity of the punishment that you choose for each child? Severity…meaning…the length of the punishment….and the parameters of the punishment…
I think the severity has to fit the “crime”. There’s but so much havoc my 3 y.o. daughter can create (so far) and in order for her to learn from her mistakes my punishments have to be short and sweet so that she actually learns about consequences vs. doing something that will cause her to cry uncontrollably and not take anything in. Also I’m not going to hold much over my 3 year old’s head for long because her ability to retain it right now is low. On the other hand my son’s punishments are becoming more severe in nature (loss of privileges) and duration because he’s 14 and needs to learn to stand behind his mistakes/egregious behavior, or simply do what is required to avoid the bad consequences in the first place, just like we adults have to on a daily basis.
I’d also like to add that my mom was old school when it came to disciplining me and my sister, which meant spankings or most commonly known as “ass whoopin’s.” I have decided not spank my kids. Threatening to spank, an not actually following through tends to work. Of course so do the time out’s and revoked privileges.
I am always fulfilled when my children successfully attempt things that they had been afraid to try before.
I really like these fatherhood round tables, it helps put things into perspective for me.
We’ve lived apart from immediate family for years – most of which are dispersed hours if not a plane flight away. We love our families, dysfunction and function, but wish they were close since we have a family now. I miss the extended family I had as a child.
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